WFMU: Irwin Chusid: Playlist from July 9, 2014

Listener comments!
	3:04pm Laura L: Well, hello there, Irwin.
	🎸 ♥ 3:05pm rrg: Hi, Laura! And Irwin!
	3:06pm P-90: Greetings DJ Irwin and everyone on this Joe Frank Wednesday.
	♥ 3:06pm Irwin: Hello LL+rrg+etc
	3:06pm Laura L: We are assembling...
	🎸 ♥ 3:07pm rrg: I get the armchair.
	3:08pm Laura L: Got an ottoman?
	🎸 ♥ 3:09pm rrg: That's mine too.
	3:10pm P-90: Those pen and ink drawings are awesome. I'm suitably intrigued.
	3:11pm Laura L: Who's going to contribute the sequiturs?
	3:11pm glenn: the armchair empire doesn't have as nice a ring to it.
	3:13pm P-90: I call the pony hide Le Corbusier chaise lounge, as usual.
	3:14pm Droll: Hey! That's My Little Pony!
	♥ 3:14pm fred: Is there a competition to get the armchair? I'd love to lose that one and sit on the floor.
	🎸 ♥ 3:15pm rrg: I have this song as a piano duet by Duke Ellington and Billy Strayhorn. It's...different from this.
	🎸 ♥ 3:15pm rrg: Okay, Laura, there's a sequitur for you.
	🎸 ♥ 3:16pm rrg: Counter with a non.
	3:16pm armchair imperialist: the armchair empire sounds delightful. Long may it reign.
	3:18pm Laura L: The rain in Spain falls mainly on the ottomans and easy chairs.
	3:19pm P-90: The funky blue denim beanbag chair is up for grabs.....just a few cat hairs, part of the charm
	3:21pm ccrides: I'm sitting on the rug...biding my time...drinking some wine...etc...:)O(:..
	3:22pm Laura L: Don't get a hole in your beanbag chair or you will find out it isn't really beans in there.
	♥ 3:23pm fred: @ccrides: I have claims on that rug, don't tread on me. Just letting you know
	3:24pm P-90: The funky denim beanbag chair also comes with a glass of Funky Cold Medina
	3:25pm ccrides: I'll share it with ya, Fred...we can go on a magical mystery 'ride' together...hehehe...:)O(:..
	3:27pm Michael: Hiya gang. Happy middle-of-the-workweek to you all! Love the illustrations, anticipating learning more from your guests.
	3:27pm P-90: Now, now, there is PLENTY of room on that rug. Also you can check whether Great-Grandma is still breathing in her rocking chair. If not you can gently remover her and sit there...
	3:32pm ccrides: Mmmm...seven second delay sounds like it should be interesting!!!...I just love them Beatle Boyz!!...:)O(:..
	3:33pm Listening Out There: FineFine drumming in Badbadnotgood
	3:35pm Robert: Obviously a different "Kaleidoscope" from the one Fabio plays.
	🎸 ♥ 3:41pm rrg: Tell us what this is, please! Oh, all right, I'll wait for the break.
	3:42pm V Priceless: Hey Irwin! Great choice in early forgotten Alice Cooper classics!
	♥ 3:42pm Irwin: rrg: from a cassette.
	3:42pm berbo: I liked it better in the original Urdu.
	🎸 ♥ 3:44pm rrg: discogs.com claims that it was released on CD. In 1992. In Sweden.
	🎸 ♥ 3:46pm rrg: Some of the Salma and Sabina ABBA covers (well, at least one of them) can be found on YouTube.
	🎸 ♥ 3:48pm rrg: One of these days you should just tell the National Weather Service to fuck off. WFMU should just say, "we don't do that." What are they going to do, take away your license?
	♥ 3:48pm Irwin: The S&S cassette is dated 1981 U.K.
	3:48pm Droll: I once recorded an ABBA cover. Lots of people hated it, even the singer I recorded it with. I swear I didn't do a prog version -- it was shoegaze.
	🎸 ♥ 3:49pm rrg: Droll, please explain "shoegaze" to me.
	3:52pm Droll: rrg, Too many guitars with too much gain & distortion, downtempo, legato melodic vocals (sound over words), big drums, bass on top.
	3:54pm glenn: welp, i'm off to my local to cheer on the dutch.
	♥ 3:54pm YETI BOB: does irwin always have an orange background or is he a NL supporter?
	🎸 ♥ 3:58pm rrg: The best mashups can be found on this program. There's no need to look anywhere else.
	3:58pm ᏠЄႶႶỊѺµЄ: You just lost a listener with this mashup.
	🎸 ♥ 3:58pm mark: Great mashup.
	🎸 ♥ 3:59pm rrg: Thank god SHE's gone.
	3:59pm ccrides: Groovy backbeat!!!...:)O(:..
	4:00pm berbo: With that tremelo voice, Belinda could sing for Journey.
	4:00pm Robert: rrg, if I haven't recommended them already, the best mashups are Neil Cicierega's "Crocodile Chop", "Mullet With Butterfly Wings", and "Smooth Flow".
	♥ 4:00pm fred: @rrg: FXO is best, IMHO. Irwin rules too, it's the opposite of picking your poison
	4:01pm Droll: So-called Mashups are the Great Divider. Count me squarely in the group that thinks playing two songs at once requires neither skill nor creativity. It's just piracy to me.
	4:03pm Listening Out There: The mashup by the Emergency Alert System wasn't so good, I thought...
	♥ 4:08pm fred: @Droll: many are crap, but some are great, you should give the form a chance. Or two, there's a lot of crap there. But the outlier is worth it. It's kinda always this way, isn't it?
	4:11pm Droll: fred, It doesn't matter if I like them or not. They are, by every definition, stealing from actual songwriters and actual musicians. I do not like that. Full stop.
	4:12pm Robert: But you could say that the compilation of recorded material that comprises this show is "stealing" from them as well.
	4:17pm Droll: Robert, Licensed radio stations keep play logs and are audited by rights management organizations so musicians get paid (a small amount) for the mechanical reproduction. Furthermore, Irwin does not stick his name on every song and expect to be given credit for it the way laptop operators do.
	♥ 4:18pm fred: @Droll: I disagree. In my opinion every musician and artist ever stole from those who came before. I can't argue though, so I concede and leave. Your position is strong, I have to think it over for a while
	4:20pm Robert: Droll, do you know that commercial mashup producers don't similarly pay license fees?
	4:23pm The Guy Who Knows Everything about Led Zep: Please play the full version next time. Ta.
	4:29pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: 'Copyright Criminals' is a great doc about all that : www.youtube.com... ...Watch it there & - you don't have to pay !!...
	♥ 4:30pm fred: @Droll: don't take this as dismissing you. I said I had to think it over and meant it, and that means days or weeks, not seconds. Food for thought is the best ever, but digesting it takes a while if done right
	4:31pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Combining two songs together isn't stealing "by every definition." Nor do most artists see any useful amount money from rights management organizations. There are definitions that call the rights management organizations the thieves. There are many definitions of everything. We're not near "full stop" yet.
	4:32pm Droll: Commercial mashups must be licensed or the seller will get sued by the rights holders. Labels spent most of the late 90's suing each other for unlicensed samples, but that eventually devolved into a game of whack-a-mole. Labels are very careful about that stuff now. Some mashups are commissioned by the original artists, but most mashups are using pirated stem tracks. The Beatles, I am positive, do not license mashups. And RRN is right -- YouTube's business model, in a word, is "Piracy".
	♥ 4:33pm Irwin: Droll: there's no "theft" involved. It's a creative hobby, done at home or in a studio. Mashup artists don't -- can't, legally -- sell their work, unless they license source material from the rights owners. GHP started as a hobbyist, but eventually was hired by several major labels to mash up their catalog (Blondie/Doors "Rapture Rider" comes to mind). Everyone involved got paid. I like mashups. Nothing is destroyed. The originals still exist.
	4:33pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Droll: Nor are The Beatles suing for making mashups. Just sayin'. And, yes, YouTube's business model is unquestionably theft for profit.
	4:38pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: It's obviously Creativity - as much as it's obviously a different sort of Creativity than songwriting & performing & recording. Also - seems to me it's the opposite of trying to obscure your sources, but the fun of showing what you did w/ them. ...Anyhow - they have us squabbling about fractions of percentages while a certain few are getting obscenely wealthy in this world @ our expense - but that's Politrix !...
	4:41pm Droll: The unauthorized stems and tools to combine them are so readily available it's a hopeless mess -- I understand people like mashups and there's no practical way to stop them. Like I said, it's become a game of whack-a-mole. I also understand it's impossible for a musician to compete against a free version of their own back catalog, transformed or not. The loss is that without rights protection for musicians, it's impossible to have a class of professional musicians to produce new professional quality work. All we'll have in 20 years are amateurs and samplers.
	4:42pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Droll: I agree with your argument, except that it's muddied by categorically including mashups in it.
	♥ 4:43pm fred: @RRN63: Can I give you an "Amen" to that? I'm really happy to see you back. I missed you
	♥ 4:46pm Eef Tunkel: joe frank gets wacky
	4:47pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: Cheers fred. The business model of The Biz is probably broken; 'Copyright Criminals' raises these questions as well as the Creative ones. Citing technology is obviously on target too...Wait till they're cloning you from a hair - this won't seem so relevant...
	4:50pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: ...I mean - we're here instead of commercial radio or something; we've already Dropped Out...
	♥ 4:51pm Rich in Washington: I think taking a fragment of music out of its original context and reframing it into another is definitely art and is creative. Using someone's booty-shakin' groove and simply using it to make your own booty-shakin' song is somewhat less creative, IMO. To me, mashup artists like RIAA, Lobsterdust, Go Home Productions, Evolution Control Committee, et al. are really creative. They make jaw-droppingly weird or funny or spooky sounds by reframing and juxtaposing familiar sounds in new settings. I find Girl Talk's stuff less creative. It's using really, really familiar and immediately recognizable dance tracks to make new dance tracks. It's kind of the modern equivalent to Stars on 45. It offers nothing new in terms of creativity or artistic commentary.
	♥ 4:51pm fred: Can't see why they would clone me. Looks like a losing proposition. Then again it might bring more $$$ for the station, so it could be a good idea
	4:52pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Girl Talk has also done some interesting and creative things, too.
	4:53pm ccrides: I wonder how many songs with three chords, like A, G and D are copyrighted??? and how careful someone has to be, when they make a new one???...LOL...:)O(:..
	4:54pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): @ccrides: See George Harrison vs. whomever re: My Sweet Lord
	4:54pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: ...okay - but your genetics can tell your race(s), specifically, & your chances of disease &tc. - You can't copyright a song title...
	4:55pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): But even Girl Talk's best moments offer no artistic commentary at all, true.
	4:56pm Jack: George really got screwed. "My Sweet Lord" only very vaguely sounds like "He's So Fine".
	4:56pm Jack: George really got screwed. "My Sweet Lord" only very vaguely sounds like "He's So Fine".
	4:56pm the weirdest jesus: Anyone remember back when writing was invented and all the storytellers couldnt compete with writen and edited copies of their old stories?
	4:57pm ccrides: I always thought that was a 'crock' when they won that case, Ken...I mean, a person might wake up with a tune playing in their head that they thought was inspired by a dream and then have to worry about getting sued by some shmuck?!?...give me a break!!!...:)O(:
	🎸 ♥ 4:57pm rrg: And George even wrote a song about how he got screwed.
	4:57pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: ...I hate just having my picture taken - & everyone has a tiny camera everywhere now - easily publishable everywhere instantly ; I believe (?) the picturetaker has the right to the photo - not you...
	♥ 4:57pm Rich in Washington: I don't dislike Girl Talk. I don't disagree that he's done some pretty creative stuff. I just think if someone wants to approach defending Mashup and collage from an almost Fair Use standpoint, it's all about making something new that comments on the constituent parts or reframes them in a new context, rather than remixing dance songs. Maybe GT does the latter more than I think. I've just found the last couple of albums somewhat uninteresting from an art standpoint.
	4:59pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: - they do exactly,ccrides ! - & that doc says George hated Sampling !
	5:00pm Droll: Try to take those arguments to a record store and use them to walk out the door with a bunch of LPs or CDs without paying. The only reason people do it is because there's nobody there to slap handcuffs on the wrist they clicked the mouse with. TV is already sliding down the same slope as the music industry, and the film industry is next.
	♥ 5:01pm fred: My genetics are as boring as I am, meaning they should come with an advisory label: "You may off yourself rather than deal with that crap"
	5:01pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Re; Joe Frank credits: Wish I had someone making my loops for me
	5:01pm ccrides: Like Lennon and Chuck Berry over the song...Ya Can't Catch Me...I think they settled out of court???...:)O(:
	5:02pm P-90: @fred: HAhahahaha! Right on...!
	5:02pm Jack: RRN63: my religion believes that when someone takes your picture, they are stealing part of your soul, and that we have the God given right to smash the camera.
	♥ 5:02pm Mike East: I'll make you some loops, Kenzo
	🎸 ♥ 5:02pm rrg: My county was NOT in that list.
	5:03pm berbo: Why can't all musicians be original, like Led Zeppelin?
	5:04pm ccrides: Berbo...and Terry Reid and Randy California!!!...hehehe...:)O(:..
	5:05pm Jack: I have a theory - call me crazy - but I think that Jandek has stolen all of his music. I just can't figure out from whom.
	5:08pm P-90: ...it was always only a matter of time until Jandek came into this, I suppose. sigh
	♥ 5:09pm Whosondephone: check the poler pattern on the mic
	5:10pm ccrides: P-90, thank Jimmy Carl Jack...the indian of the group!!!...hahaha...:)O(:..
	🎸 ♥ 5:23pm rrg: This girl was only 10 years old? Wow.
	♥ 5:25pm holland oats: LOVING THIS
	5:26pm P-90: Someone should introduce Brian and Valerie to Clay Pigeon
	5:34pm ccrides: Someone told me that if you start the full album 'The Wall' by Pink Floyd, on the second or third roar of the MGM lion at the beginning of 'The Wizard of Oz' movie and then turn down the sound to the movie and watch...something weird will happen???...:)O(:...
	🎸 ♥ 5:35pm rrg: Grace London's Web site: www.gracelondonmusic.com
	🎸 ♥ 5:36pm rrg: Her YouTube channel: www.youtube.com...
	5:51pm ccrides: Great show today Irwin..!..Cheerz!!!!...:)O(:..
	5:52pm Robert: He used the real names of real people, according to his classmate Betty May (nee Grimes). Yes, Bumpus was the real name of real people.
	5:53pm Robert: Shep denied it when I asked him, but she confirmed it when I got back to her afterward.
	🎸 ♥ 5:55pm rrg: Thanks for today's show, Mr. Irwin. And thanks to your guests.
	5:58pm Laura L: What rrg done said.
	5:58pm P-90: OK but curious: Was real-life Bumpus like "character" Bumpus?
	5:59pm P-90: Thanks for a fun ride DJ Irwin, Brian and Valerie, Ivy, the wacky Comments Gang, and Joe frank, wherever you are
	🎸 ♥ 6:01pm rrg: You better play us that Grace London album, Irwin.
	6:02pm Robert: P-90, Betty May said they really were "hillbillies".

Irwin Chusid: Playlist from July 9, 2014

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July 9, 2014: Brian Beattie and Valerie Fowler present Ivy and the Wicker Suitcase

Listen to this show: Pop-up listen Pop-up player!

From Ivy and the Wicker Suitcase

Illustrations by Valerie Fowler
Songs, story, and music by Brian Beattie

Artist	Track	Album	Approx. start time
Lee Morgan	Yes I Can, No You Can't (edit)	The Gigolo	0:00:00 (Pop-up)
Emma Pollock	You'll Come Around "You'll Come Around" by "Emma Pollock"	Watch the Fireworks	0:03:48 (Pop-up)

Art Blakey Percussion Ensemble	Oscalypso	Drum Suite	0:08:58 (Pop-up)
Ceefax	Don't Be Scared "Don't Be Scared" by "Ceefax"	Tasty Morsels, Vol. 2	0:17:08 (Pop-up)
Jim Sullivan	So Natural "So Natural" by "Jim Sullivan"	U.F.O.	0:20:26 (Pop-up)
Orenda Fink	You Can Be Loved "You Can Be Loved" by "Orenda Fink"	Blue Dream	0:23:07 (Pop-up)

Badbadnotgood	Kaleidoscope "Kaleidoscope" by "Badbadnotgood"	III	0:31:08 (Pop-up)
Alice Cooper	Laughing at Me "Laughing at Me" by "Alice Cooper"	Easy Action	0:37:31 (Pop-up)
Salma & Sabina	Pehli Pehli Preet (Super Trooper)	Sing the Hits of ABBA in Hindi	0:39:51 (Pop-up)

Minisnap	Coppice "Coppice" by "Minisnap"	Bounce Around	0:47:00 (Pop-up)
Beach Boys	Little Bird "Little Bird" by "Beach Boys"	Friends	0:50:16 (Pop-up)
Jan Bradley	Mama Didn't Lie "Mama Didn't Lie" by "Jan Bradley"	Soul Boppin' Ladies	0:51:51 (Pop-up)
Pierre Bastien	Caravan "Caravan" by "Pierre Bastien"	Les Premieres Machines, 1968-1988	0:53:59 (Pop-up)
Belinda Carlisle vs. The Beatles	Daytrip to Heaven	Go Home Productions	0:56:31 (Pop-up)

Brian Beattie	Ivy's Dream "Ivy's Dream" by "Brian Beattie"	Ivy & the Wicker Suitcase	2:03:19 (Pop-up)
Brian Beattie & Valerie Fowler	interview seg 1		2:06:25 (Pop-up)
K. McCarty & Grace London	That No Account Cosmo Wire	Ivy & the Wicker Suitcase	2:15:44 (Pop-up)
Grace London & K. McCarty	Kitchen-Caliche	Ivy & the Wicker Suitcase	2:19:11 (Pop-up)
Grace London & Ramona Beattie	Caliche Road	Ivy & the Wicker Suitcase	2:21:14 (Pop-up)
Grace London	Well-Creek "Well-Creek" by "Grace London"	Ivy & the Wicker Suitcase	2:23:09 (Pop-up)
Brian Beattie & Valerie Fowler	interview seg 2		2:23:43 (Pop-up)
Grace London. Scott Marcus, & Will Sheff	Lava-Office	Ivy & the Wicker Suitcase	2:35:27 (Pop-up)
Will Sheff & Grace London	Busy, Busy, Busy/Nothing is Something	Ivy & the Wicker Suitcase	2:41:11 (Pop-up)
Brian Beattie & Valerie Fowler	interview seg 3		2:46:14 (Pop-up)
Bill Callahan	I Was Sleeping "I Was Sleeping" by "Bill Callahan"	Ivy & the Wicker Suitcase	2:54:16 (Pop-up)

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Listener comments!
	3:04pm Laura L: Well, hello there, Irwin.
	🎸 ♥ 3:05pm rrg: Hi, Laura! And Irwin!
	3:06pm P-90: Greetings DJ Irwin and everyone on this Joe Frank Wednesday.
	♥ 3:06pm Irwin: Hello LL+rrg+etc
	3:06pm Laura L: We are assembling...
	🎸 ♥ 3:07pm rrg: I get the armchair.
	3:08pm Laura L: Got an ottoman?
	🎸 ♥ 3:09pm rrg: That's mine too.
	3:10pm P-90: Those pen and ink drawings are awesome. I'm suitably intrigued.
	3:11pm Laura L: Who's going to contribute the sequiturs?
	3:11pm glenn: the armchair empire doesn't have as nice a ring to it.
	3:13pm P-90: I call the pony hide Le Corbusier chaise lounge, as usual.
	3:14pm Droll: Hey! That's My Little Pony!
	♥ 3:14pm fred: Is there a competition to get the armchair? I'd love to lose that one and sit on the floor.
	🎸 ♥ 3:15pm rrg: I have this song as a piano duet by Duke Ellington and Billy Strayhorn. It's...different from this.
	🎸 ♥ 3:15pm rrg: Okay, Laura, there's a sequitur for you.
	🎸 ♥ 3:16pm rrg: Counter with a non.
	3:16pm armchair imperialist: the armchair empire sounds delightful. Long may it reign.
	3:18pm Laura L: The rain in Spain falls mainly on the ottomans and easy chairs.
	3:19pm P-90: The funky blue denim beanbag chair is up for grabs.....just a few cat hairs, part of the charm
	3:21pm ccrides: I'm sitting on the rug...biding my time...drinking some wine...etc...:)O(:..
	3:22pm Laura L: Don't get a hole in your beanbag chair or you will find out it isn't really beans in there.
	♥ 3:23pm fred: @ccrides: I have claims on that rug, don't tread on me. Just letting you know
	3:24pm P-90: The funky denim beanbag chair also comes with a glass of Funky Cold Medina
	3:25pm ccrides: I'll share it with ya, Fred...we can go on a magical mystery 'ride' together...hehehe...:)O(:..
	3:27pm Michael: Hiya gang. Happy middle-of-the-workweek to you all! Love the illustrations, anticipating learning more from your guests.
	3:27pm P-90: Now, now, there is PLENTY of room on that rug. Also you can check whether Great-Grandma is still breathing in her rocking chair. If not you can gently remover her and sit there...
	3:32pm ccrides: Mmmm...seven second delay sounds like it should be interesting!!!...I just love them Beatle Boyz!!...:)O(:..
	3:33pm Listening Out There: FineFine drumming in Badbadnotgood
	3:35pm Robert: Obviously a different "Kaleidoscope" from the one Fabio plays.
	🎸 ♥ 3:41pm rrg: Tell us what this is, please! Oh, all right, I'll wait for the break.
	3:42pm V Priceless: Hey Irwin! Great choice in early forgotten Alice Cooper classics!
	♥ 3:42pm Irwin: rrg: from a cassette.
	3:42pm berbo: I liked it better in the original Urdu.
	🎸 ♥ 3:44pm rrg: discogs.com claims that it was released on CD. In 1992. In Sweden.
	🎸 ♥ 3:46pm rrg: Some of the Salma and Sabina ABBA covers (well, at least one of them) can be found on YouTube.
	🎸 ♥ 3:48pm rrg: One of these days you should just tell the National Weather Service to fuck off. WFMU should just say, "we don't do that." What are they going to do, take away your license?
	♥ 3:48pm Irwin: The S&S cassette is dated 1981 U.K.
	3:48pm Droll: I once recorded an ABBA cover. Lots of people hated it, even the singer I recorded it with. I swear I didn't do a prog version -- it was shoegaze.
	🎸 ♥ 3:49pm rrg: Droll, please explain "shoegaze" to me.
	3:52pm Droll: rrg, Too many guitars with too much gain & distortion, downtempo, legato melodic vocals (sound over words), big drums, bass on top.
	3:54pm glenn: welp, i'm off to my local to cheer on the dutch.
	♥ 3:54pm YETI BOB: does irwin always have an orange background or is he a NL supporter?
	🎸 ♥ 3:58pm rrg: The best mashups can be found on this program. There's no need to look anywhere else.
	3:58pm ᏠЄႶႶỊѺµЄ: You just lost a listener with this mashup.
	🎸 ♥ 3:58pm mark: Great mashup.
	🎸 ♥ 3:59pm rrg: Thank god SHE's gone.
	3:59pm ccrides: Groovy backbeat!!!...:)O(:..
	4:00pm berbo: With that tremelo voice, Belinda could sing for Journey.
	4:00pm Robert: rrg, if I haven't recommended them already, the best mashups are Neil Cicierega's "Crocodile Chop", "Mullet With Butterfly Wings", and "Smooth Flow".
	♥ 4:00pm fred: @rrg: FXO is best, IMHO. Irwin rules too, it's the opposite of picking your poison
	4:01pm Droll: So-called Mashups are the Great Divider. Count me squarely in the group that thinks playing two songs at once requires neither skill nor creativity. It's just piracy to me.
	4:03pm Listening Out There: The mashup by the Emergency Alert System wasn't so good, I thought...
	♥ 4:08pm fred: @Droll: many are crap, but some are great, you should give the form a chance. Or two, there's a lot of crap there. But the outlier is worth it. It's kinda always this way, isn't it?
	4:11pm Droll: fred, It doesn't matter if I like them or not. They are, by every definition, stealing from actual songwriters and actual musicians. I do not like that. Full stop.
	4:12pm Robert: But you could say that the compilation of recorded material that comprises this show is "stealing" from them as well.
	4:17pm Droll: Robert, Licensed radio stations keep play logs and are audited by rights management organizations so musicians get paid (a small amount) for the mechanical reproduction. Furthermore, Irwin does not stick his name on every song and expect to be given credit for it the way laptop operators do.
	♥ 4:18pm fred: @Droll: I disagree. In my opinion every musician and artist ever stole from those who came before. I can't argue though, so I concede and leave. Your position is strong, I have to think it over for a while
	4:20pm Robert: Droll, do you know that commercial mashup producers don't similarly pay license fees?
	4:23pm The Guy Who Knows Everything about Led Zep: Please play the full version next time. Ta.
	4:29pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: 'Copyright Criminals' is a great doc about all that : www.youtube.com... ...Watch it there & - you don't have to pay !!...
	♥ 4:30pm fred: @Droll: don't take this as dismissing you. I said I had to think it over and meant it, and that means days or weeks, not seconds. Food for thought is the best ever, but digesting it takes a while if done right
	4:31pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Combining two songs together isn't stealing "by every definition." Nor do most artists see any useful amount money from rights management organizations. There are definitions that call the rights management organizations the thieves. There are many definitions of everything. We're not near "full stop" yet.
	4:32pm Droll: Commercial mashups must be licensed or the seller will get sued by the rights holders. Labels spent most of the late 90's suing each other for unlicensed samples, but that eventually devolved into a game of whack-a-mole. Labels are very careful about that stuff now. Some mashups are commissioned by the original artists, but most mashups are using pirated stem tracks. The Beatles, I am positive, do not license mashups. And RRN is right -- YouTube's business model, in a word, is "Piracy".
	♥ 4:33pm Irwin: Droll: there's no "theft" involved. It's a creative hobby, done at home or in a studio. Mashup artists don't -- can't, legally -- sell their work, unless they license source material from the rights owners. GHP started as a hobbyist, but eventually was hired by several major labels to mash up their catalog (Blondie/Doors "Rapture Rider" comes to mind). Everyone involved got paid. I like mashups. Nothing is destroyed. The originals still exist.
	4:33pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Droll: Nor are The Beatles suing for making mashups. Just sayin'. And, yes, YouTube's business model is unquestionably theft for profit.
	4:38pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: It's obviously Creativity - as much as it's obviously a different sort of Creativity than songwriting & performing & recording. Also - seems to me it's the opposite of trying to obscure your sources, but the fun of showing what you did w/ them. ...Anyhow - they have us squabbling about fractions of percentages while a certain few are getting obscenely wealthy in this world @ our expense - but that's Politrix !...
	4:41pm Droll: The unauthorized stems and tools to combine them are so readily available it's a hopeless mess -- I understand people like mashups and there's no practical way to stop them. Like I said, it's become a game of whack-a-mole. I also understand it's impossible for a musician to compete against a free version of their own back catalog, transformed or not. The loss is that without rights protection for musicians, it's impossible to have a class of professional musicians to produce new professional quality work. All we'll have in 20 years are amateurs and samplers.
	4:42pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Droll: I agree with your argument, except that it's muddied by categorically including mashups in it.
	♥ 4:43pm fred: @RRN63: Can I give you an "Amen" to that? I'm really happy to see you back. I missed you
	♥ 4:46pm Eef Tunkel: joe frank gets wacky
	4:47pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: Cheers fred. The business model of The Biz is probably broken; 'Copyright Criminals' raises these questions as well as the Creative ones. Citing technology is obviously on target too...Wait till they're cloning you from a hair - this won't seem so relevant...
	4:50pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: ...I mean - we're here instead of commercial radio or something; we've already Dropped Out...
	♥ 4:51pm Rich in Washington: I think taking a fragment of music out of its original context and reframing it into another is definitely art and is creative. Using someone's booty-shakin' groove and simply using it to make your own booty-shakin' song is somewhat less creative, IMO. To me, mashup artists like RIAA, Lobsterdust, Go Home Productions, Evolution Control Committee, et al. are really creative. They make jaw-droppingly weird or funny or spooky sounds by reframing and juxtaposing familiar sounds in new settings. I find Girl Talk's stuff less creative. It's using really, really familiar and immediately recognizable dance tracks to make new dance tracks. It's kind of the modern equivalent to Stars on 45. It offers nothing new in terms of creativity or artistic commentary.
	♥ 4:51pm fred: Can't see why they would clone me. Looks like a losing proposition. Then again it might bring more $$$ for the station, so it could be a good idea
	4:52pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Girl Talk has also done some interesting and creative things, too.
	4:53pm ccrides: I wonder how many songs with three chords, like A, G and D are copyrighted??? and how careful someone has to be, when they make a new one???...LOL...:)O(:..
	4:54pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): @ccrides: See George Harrison vs. whomever re: My Sweet Lord
	4:54pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: ...okay - but your genetics can tell your race(s), specifically, & your chances of disease &tc. - You can't copyright a song title...
	4:55pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): But even Girl Talk's best moments offer no artistic commentary at all, true.
	4:56pm Jack: George really got screwed. "My Sweet Lord" only very vaguely sounds like "He's So Fine".
	4:56pm Jack: George really got screwed. "My Sweet Lord" only very vaguely sounds like "He's So Fine".
	4:56pm the weirdest jesus: Anyone remember back when writing was invented and all the storytellers couldnt compete with writen and edited copies of their old stories?
	4:57pm ccrides: I always thought that was a 'crock' when they won that case, Ken...I mean, a person might wake up with a tune playing in their head that they thought was inspired by a dream and then have to worry about getting sued by some shmuck?!?...give me a break!!!...:)O(:
	🎸 ♥ 4:57pm rrg: And George even wrote a song about how he got screwed.
	4:57pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: ...I hate just having my picture taken - & everyone has a tiny camera everywhere now - easily publishable everywhere instantly ; I believe (?) the picturetaker has the right to the photo - not you...
	♥ 4:57pm Rich in Washington: I don't dislike Girl Talk. I don't disagree that he's done some pretty creative stuff. I just think if someone wants to approach defending Mashup and collage from an almost Fair Use standpoint, it's all about making something new that comments on the constituent parts or reframes them in a new context, rather than remixing dance songs. Maybe GT does the latter more than I think. I've just found the last couple of albums somewhat uninteresting from an art standpoint.
	4:59pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63: - they do exactly,ccrides ! - & that doc says George hated Sampling !
	5:00pm Droll: Try to take those arguments to a record store and use them to walk out the door with a bunch of LPs or CDs without paying. The only reason people do it is because there's nobody there to slap handcuffs on the wrist they clicked the mouse with. TV is already sliding down the same slope as the music industry, and the film industry is next.
	♥ 5:01pm fred: My genetics are as boring as I am, meaning they should come with an advisory label: "You may off yourself rather than deal with that crap"
	5:01pm Kenzo (Ken's Last Ever): Re; Joe Frank credits: Wish I had someone making my loops for me
	5:01pm ccrides: Like Lennon and Chuck Berry over the song...Ya Can't Catch Me...I think they settled out of court???...:)O(:
	5:02pm P-90: @fred: HAhahahaha! Right on...!
	5:02pm Jack: RRN63: my religion believes that when someone takes your picture, they are stealing part of your soul, and that we have the God given right to smash the camera.
	♥ 5:02pm Mike East: I'll make you some loops, Kenzo
	🎸 ♥ 5:02pm rrg: My county was NOT in that list.
	5:03pm berbo: Why can't all musicians be original, like Led Zeppelin?
	5:04pm ccrides: Berbo...and Terry Reid and Randy California!!!...hehehe...:)O(:..
	5:05pm Jack: I have a theory - call me crazy - but I think that Jandek has stolen all of his music. I just can't figure out from whom.
	5:08pm P-90: ...it was always only a matter of time until Jandek came into this, I suppose. sigh
	♥ 5:09pm Whosondephone: check the poler pattern on the mic
	5:10pm ccrides: P-90, thank Jimmy Carl Jack...the indian of the group!!!...hahaha...:)O(:..
	🎸 ♥ 5:23pm rrg: This girl was only 10 years old? Wow.
	♥ 5:25pm holland oats: LOVING THIS
	5:26pm P-90: Someone should introduce Brian and Valerie to Clay Pigeon
	5:34pm ccrides: Someone told me that if you start the full album 'The Wall' by Pink Floyd, on the second or third roar of the MGM lion at the beginning of 'The Wizard of Oz' movie and then turn down the sound to the movie and watch...something weird will happen???...:)O(:...
	🎸 ♥ 5:35pm rrg: Grace London's Web site: www.gracelondonmusic.com
	🎸 ♥ 5:36pm rrg: Her YouTube channel: www.youtube.com...
	5:51pm ccrides: Great show today Irwin..!..Cheerz!!!!...:)O(:..
	5:52pm Robert: He used the real names of real people, according to his classmate Betty May (nee Grimes). Yes, Bumpus was the real name of real people.
	5:53pm Robert: Shep denied it when I asked him, but she confirmed it when I got back to her afterward.
	🎸 ♥ 5:55pm rrg: Thanks for today's show, Mr. Irwin. And thanks to your guests.
	5:58pm Laura L: What rrg done said.
	5:58pm P-90: OK but curious: Was real-life Bumpus like "character" Bumpus?
	5:59pm P-90: Thanks for a fun ride DJ Irwin, Brian and Valerie, Ivy, the wacky Comments Gang, and Joe frank, wherever you are
	🎸 ♥ 6:01pm rrg: You better play us that Grace London album, Irwin.
	6:02pm Robert: P-90, Betty May said they really were "hillbillies".

Irwin Chusid: Playlist from July 9, 2014

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