WFMU: Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from April 10, 2023

Listener comments!
	6:04pm Hopey Sockmonkey: Thanks for filling in, Ken!
	6:04pm Doug in MP: Matt Taibbi 😬
	🤖 6:04pm Will thee Sound Guy: Hi Staysh and all!!!
	6:05pm wholewheattoast: yeah... let's see how this goes but, uh, huh.
	🤖 6:05pm Bas NL: Hi Ken! All!
	🤖 6:05pm Ken From Hyde Park: Welcome to Kentech! All your data is belong to WFMU!
	6:05pm Doug in MP: Oh no. oh boy
	6:06pm melinda: howdy Ken and others
	6:06pm dale: never twittered. or instant grammed. lots of pornhub though....
	6:06pm Jim the Poet: Popping popcorn
	6:07pm rhett: Fuck Taibbi.
	🤖 6:07pm Handy Haversack: Evening, Ken and the Techyon Drives!
	6:07pm Ike: ↳ wholewheattoast @6:05 Um, yeah.
	6:07pm melinda: I agree Ken. The critics of the Twitter files are avoiding dealing with the substance of the files.
	🤖 6:07pm Will thee Sound Guy: ↳ Ken From Hyde Park @6:05 nice
	6:07pm drew: why is ken freedman associating with a known rapist and woman hater, oh wait is that "slander"
	6:09pm HyperDose: Stir that pot, Ken! 😎
	6:09pm Doug in MP: "ambushed" oh ken. back to bandcamp
	6:10pm melinda: ↳ Doug in MP @6:09 it was an ambush
	6:10pm Ike: That said, it doesn't have to be black and white when it comes to Twitter corporate management. Both current AND former Twitter management can be absolute trash, in different ways.
	🤖 6:10pm herb.nyc: Ooh, lefties get slagged! Right-wingers too, I assume. But do they get complimented at all?
	6:11pm yippie: the Fugs rock opera Star Peace has a cool song called Technology
	🤖 6:11pm Webhamster Henry: Elon whited out the "w" on the Twitter HQ banner so it kind of reads "T_itter". As well as sticking that Dogecoin doggie in instead of the Twitterbird. Whattup wid dat?
	🤖 6:11pm Handy Haversack: Wait, there are people on the Left who like the NYT and MSNBC? Have ... they ever actually read them?
	6:12pm chrisw: Describing the twitter owners as having fleeced Elon Musk is a novel take!
	6:12pm melinda: The pod w/Walter Kirn is really good.
	🤖 6:13pm Will thee Sound Guy: that 60 hz+ harmonics in the right channel is light, but rough
	6:14pm drew: Wait! What? I hate this show and was turning it off when I recognized Matt Taibbi's voice. Deftly played, Mark.
	6:14pm Ike: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:11 You wouldn't think so. But those are considered "liberal" by large portions of the country, among normies too basic to be aware of better sources.
	6:14pm -жеи: ↳ drew @6:07 Drew, the allegations that Taibbi abused women at The Exile office in Moscow, were debunked by the women themselves, who went on record to say that nothing of the sort that was described ever happened.
	6:15pm -жеи: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:11 He's a freaking buffoon is what's up with that
	6:16pm EmP: This is all very odd for this show. Which is the polite way of saying this kind of sucks.
	6:16pm Richy4619: It's really awful what people do when they think they're smarter than everyone.
	6:16pm -жеи: ↳ Will thee Sound Guy @6:13 Yeah I tried to get that buzz out of there but it created a weird flanger effect wgen it was removed.
	6:16pm drew: Hang on . . . that Kermit-y voice is Staysh! Doubly well played!
	🤖 6:17pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Ike @6:14 I have trouble believing that they would then self-identify as Left or hold positions that could be described as Left in any system or discourse not skewed as far to the Right as this one is.
	🤖 6:18pm Will thee Sound Guy: ↳ -жеи @6:16 right on, I believe that
	🤖 6:19pm chresti: Hi Ken and Techtonians!
	6:19pm DannyBoyNYC: Ambushed by Hasan? C'mon. Hasan tore him a new one. Taibbi is reporting on whatever Elon feeds him. His journalistic career is over. Go watch the interview.
	6:20pm -жеи: ↳ EmP @6:16 EmP, what is the actual reporting that you take issue with?
	🤖 6:20pm MarciB: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:11 Excellent point
	6:22pm oof: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:17 (i think he meant neoliberals)
	6:22pm Ciggy: Followed Matt Taibbi since the 2018 financial crisis. Especially the AIG scam on Brooklyn's own Joe Cassano, CMOs & MBS'. Here's today's tweet from Glenn Greewald of a 40 year old clip of Ron Paul criticizing the overreach of the FBI the US Security State (FBI/CIA) manipulating our politics and spying on Americans. twitter.com...
	6:23pm -жеи: ↳ DannyBoyNYC @6:19 So is that why Musk has now cut off Substack? Because Taibbi and Weiss and others were doing TOO good a job of doing Elon's bidding?
	6:25pm -жеи: ↳ DannyBoyNYC @6:19 The nature of the errors that Hasan pointed out (Taibbi wrote "CIS" instead of "CISA") is pretty damn trivial, especially when you consider the legion of real, serious errors that MSNBC has made over the years. Such as falling repeatedly for the Hamilton 68 hoax, which Taibbi uncovered.
	🤖 6:28pm PaulRobeson1923: Hi Hi Hi
	6:28pm pp: Ken J
	6:28pm -жеи: ↳ DannyBoyNYC @6:19 And all the errors that Hasan pointed out (live on national TV, which is why it was an ambush) were corrected by Taibbi immediately and publicly. MSNBC has not issued any corrections of it's own for repeatedly falling for the Hamilton 68 hoax.
	6:31pm pp: I remember pops Taibbi, correspondent for NBC.
	🤖 6:31pm MarciB: Muskrat bought Twitter to destroy it as a legitimate source of information.
	6:32pm dale: a dive into TRUTH social would probably read like a comedy.
	6:34pm -жеи: ↳ pp @6:31 I remember him also - he wrote for the Home News in new Brunswick which was the daily paper I grew up with.
	🤖 6:34pm Handy Haversack: I think what bothers me about the whole discussion (and while I wouldn't speak for Mark, what seems to have the most resonance with what we discuss here frequently) isn't the extent to which Twitter was or was not hand-in-glove with government "intelligence community" for censorship or whether Twitter censorship is now just based on the whim of an egoistic libertarian fuckwad but that we're at all surprised by any of it. Twitter does not exist for us or for any user. It has always and only been based on monetizing engagement through the manipulation of a publishing environment. The point isn't how terrible it was then because of THEM or is now because of OTHER THEM but that it is rotten to its core and cannot be redeemed and the only logical response to is abandon it entirely and let it die alone, as it deserves. Otherwise, we're just continuing to stick our hands in the fire and act shocked when we get burned.
	6:36pm chris in the redwoods: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:34 comment clicky-starred!
	6:38pm CIA, CIS, CISA, whatever: "CIS" for "CISA" is not trivial, it's mistaking a non-governmental nonprofit org for a federal agency, and then claiming that the feds did it.
	6:38pm Franco Twinkie: Stalinists, really? Okay, I'm throwing the Bulgarian crackers I got at Grocery Outlet in the trash.
	6:38pm grtyvr: Ken, how do I retract my S4L. Not a fan of supporting platforming this clown
	6:39pm -жеи: ↳ grtyvr @6:38 Consider it done. You lack of any specific Taibbi criticism is duly noted.
	6:40pm CIA, CIS, CISA, whatever: for reference (not guaranteed unbiased or 100% correct): https://www.techdirt.com/2023/04/07/mehdi-hasan-dismantles-the-entire-foundation-of-the-twitter-files-as-matt-taibbi-stumbles-to-defend-it/
	🤖 6:41pm PaulRobeson1923: For most of America, Russia is like that once in a lifetime trip to NYC- Russia only exists in yer imagination and the average American thinks to himself “i’ll never be able to afford that”
	6:41pm Dean: Damn, sorry I couldn't check in earlier. Handy is pointing out @6:34 the tyranny of the network effect. Honestly, I can barely distinguish Twitter under Dorsey from Twitter under Musk, but then I have no account and I read only one feed. In fact, under Musk, Twitter is proving to be (for me, not a customer) far more open.
	6:43pm Carmichael: Not that I'm a brainiac or anything, but I have never seen the value of Twitter as a platform. Other than a vehicle for one's inane rambling.
	6:43pm Dean: Glancing at Ken's comments above, I believe I am largely if not entirely aligned with his take.
	6:44pm grtyvr: Tiabbi is a sloppy "journalist" who routinely gets basic facts wrong. www.techdirt.com...
	6:44pm Rolando: Better late than never, I’ll catch up what I missed in the archives
	6:44pm melinda: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:34 Twitter might be a rotten and stinky town square but as long as its functioning as such it still matters very much that the government is censoring people there. If Twitter rotted away that wouldn't eliminate the govt-non-profit censorship partnership machine that is responsible for this.
	6:45pm grtyvr: He doesn't understand what he is looking at: www.techdirt.com...
	6:45pm Dean: I think you mean you've never see the utility of Twitter, @Carmichael. I agree. It's pointless to me. Even the one feed I follow--Greenwald's--grows tedious and redundant. Taibbi (note the spelling, @grtyvr) is not a scare-quotes journalist. He is a journalist, more productive and effective than a large number of reporters at MSM media.
	6:46pm McMurphy: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:34 Exactly. And CIA, CIS... I agree, it's far from a trivial mistake. And grtyvr, seriously? Are you listening? Are you hoping to never hear anything that doesn't jibe with your worldview?
	6:46pm dale: ↳ Carmichael @6:43 i'm both not smart enough to want a soap box. and too stupid to need one.
	6:46pm Listener Robert: ↳ -жеи @6:34 Then I guess you go me beat. Matt Taibbi came to my attention only in the 1980s when he wrote for the New York Press. But at least in my head I pronounced his last name the way it turned out he did.
	6:47pm Eli: The Hassan interview was an ambush?? Taibbi was so ill-prepared for it (something MT asked for). It was embarrassing.
	6:47pm -жеи: ↳ grtyvr @6:44 I hope some of you call on the air after the interview is over
	6:47pm Carmichael: ↳ Dean @6:45 "He is a journalist, more productive and effective than a large number of reporters" [STOP]
	6:48pm Listener Robert: ↳ -жеи @6:34 Oh, wait, you're referring to his father?
	6:48pm grtyvr: far from not wanting to not hear anything that does not jibe with my world view, but I do want to hear from someone who is thorough and does not make mistakes in understanding.
	6:48pm McMurphy: ↳ Carmichael @6:43 Clearly you've been reading my feed.
	🤖 6:48pm PaulRobeson1923: ↳ dale @6:46 We are ALL, as Huxley says someplace, Great Abbreviators, meaning that none of us has the wit to know the whole truth, the time to tell it if we believed we did, or an audience so gullible as to accept it. -Neil Postman, Amusing Ourselves to Death: Public Discourse in the Age of Show Business
	6:49pm melinda: Taibbi has said he made mistakes in his old Rolling Stone reporting on the financial crisis but I don't remember left-of-center media sources busting his balls over that.
	6:49pm Son Of Pantz: Now that Matt got his big paycheck from Musk, I hope he goes back to real journalism.
	6:49pm yippie: that's why it's so dumb when these American judges make you sweat to tell the Whole truth
	6:49pm pp: my question on Twitter -- how the funk did Evan get the handle @efd ???
	6:50pm Carmichael: ↳ McMurphy @6:48 So you have a Twitter feed for non-twitter users?
	6:51pm chris in the redwoods: ↳ grtyvr @6:48 someone inhuman, perhaps?
	6:52pm Carmichael: The phones don't have a screen we can all hide behind.
	6:53pm oof: i don't understand how musk's intentions of releasing the files aren't relevant. clearly the data leaked reflects his POV
	🤖 6:53pm PaulRobeson1923: I’d like to discuss Clay’s new “Chicken” sound bite. The softly spoken “chicken” really turns me on
	6:53pm Saltonstall: @pp- believe or not @evanfunkdavies was already taken
	🤖 6:53pm Handy Haversack: ↳ melinda @6:49 MSNBC is far to the right of center. Just want to keep that fact, er, centered.
	6:53pm melinda: ↳ Eli @6:47 You don't have to be a fan of Twitter or Musk to see how huge this is.
	6:53pm Carmichael: Hello, I'd like to buy an argument.
	🤖 6:54pm PaulRobeson1923: A man has to have a place to go in the morning.
	🤖 6:54pm Bas NL: Good point, caller.
	6:54pm melinda: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:53 How so?
	6:55pm Dean: We need a definition of "social media" before the slope gets too slippery or the ad too absurdum.
	🤖 6:55pm Handy Haversack: So if we'd had Twitter back when we had to fight off the dinosaurs, we'd never have survived? Did ... the dinosaurs have Twitter?!
	6:55pm grtyvr: Why is asking for journalists to verify sources and stories to get the facts correct an inhuman expectation?
	6:55pm Ciggy: My "Twitter Files" experience stems from the replies that ive seen change from a liberal point of view to a Trumpist POV. Today's example is an analysis of Tucker Carlson in the NY Times twitter.com...
	6:55pm melinda: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:53 Were they opposed to Taibbi before Trump and Russiagate? My point is that allegiances and biases have shifted.
	6:55pm Dano59: ↳ oof @6:53 maybe Musk's intent was to justify his re-amplifying right wing users. I dunno. It's a weird and worse place now, and I doubt Matt T. would agree, he DID say it used to be a fun place and got worse, almost insufferable, presumably during the Trump admin
	6:55pm Carmichael: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:53 Really? I don't watch it, but my assumption is that Fox News and MSNBC are the two poles that everything else falls between.
	6:56pm drew: Cracker barrels and local bars were longer-format than Twitter, but people shared opinions in free time. I'd be willing to bet that the Amish swap stories and opinions at barn-raisings, which aren't just work.
	6:56pm melinda: ↳ Carmichael @6:55 My assumption too, as a non-watcher
	6:56pm chris in the redwoods: ↳ grtyvr @6:55 asking anyone not to make mistakes is to ask of them not to be human, friend.
	6:57pm Dano59: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:53 not even sure where the center is anymore, but corporate media bias protecting a certain capital/govt. narrative is a thing, even at so-called 'liberal' networks.
	6:57pm Carmichael: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:55 @T-Rex
	6:57pm grtyvr: So where is the retractions and corrections?
	🤖 6:57pm Handy Haversack: Terms of service: wfmu.org...
	6:57pm Marie in Queens: Where do the self-identified leftists on this board get their news?
	6:57pm dale: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:48 i read a lot of huxley in my twenties. even his hollywood novel 'after many a summer the swan dies.' i need to revisit his stuff, i loved it.
	6:57pm Jeff Moore: ↳ Carmichael @6:55 Among mainstream corporate media, maybe. But the US mainstream "left" is... basically moderate right.
	6:58pm melinda: yeah, I bet it happens everywhere. Shitting on Twitter misses the point.
	6:58pm Dean: Email is not, too my mind, social media. It's a pain in the ass, but it's entirely asynchronous. Here's why talking about free speech vis-a-vis Twitter is not crazy: when the state strives to impose its own expressive policies on a private operation like Twitter, then it risks violating the First Amendment.
	🤖 6:58pm PaulRobeson1923: The people outside the United States might as well be dead. U know what i mean?
	6:58pm pp: ↳ Saltonstall @6:53 3 letter handles are rare.
	6:58pm Dano59: ↳ Carmichael @6:53 ... no you don't!
	6:58pm Son Of Pantz: We just want to be free to ride our machines and get loaded at WFMU.
	6:58pm nickelbackfanfromportugal: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:57 Usually AP for straight news, but wider than that for opinion based pieces
	6:58pm melinda: ↳ Dean @6:58 Exactly
	6:59pm Eli: ↳ melinda @6:53 Sorry, I don't think Joe Biden asking that non-consensual nude pics of his troubled son be removed from the platform is a big deal.
	6:59pm Dean: @Son Of Pantz: Heh, well said.
	6:59pm Ciggy: Here I am listening to Ken whilst viewing TYT on YouTube
	🤖 6:59pm Handy Haversack: Thanks, Ken! And MT. Efforts appreciated. And always fun when it all gets stirred up.
	6:59pm steveo: Interesting show Thanks Ken!
	6:59pm sufferwords: Operation Mockingbird- Ben Bradlee - the fix been in forever
	6:59pm dale: wfmu is that (s)crappy little station...
	6:59pm melinda: ↳ Eli @6:59 If it was merely that it wouldn't be a big deal but it was way more than that.
	🤖 6:59pm Bas NL: Thanks Ken and Matt.
	6:59pm Marie in Queens: ↳ nickelbackfanfromportugal @6:58 oh, uh huh, that makes sense to me
	7:00pm listener 126464: Thanks, Ken.
	🤖 7:00pm PaulRobeson1923: In American the gist of our foreign news stories are “where is Malaysian flight 390” or when did the queen last blow her nose?
	7:00pm Hopey Sockmonkey: Thanks, Ken!
	7:00pm melinda: ↳ sufferwords @6:59 yup
	7:00pm McMurphy: Great interview and very interesting and timely show - Thanks Ken!
	7:00pm Ciggy: On to PROG - YES!
	7:00pm Richy4619: I'm glad FMU/Techtonic/Ken are here having these kind of conversations
	7:00pm melinda: thanks Ken!
	🤖 7:00pm Will thee Sound Guy: Thank you Ken!
	7:00pm Dano59: thx Ken!
	7:03pm Matt from OK: Thanks for a great interview. The hard work of radical transparency in the sprit of EFF and FOIA advocacy is too often thankless and polarizing on the rare occasions it does get recognized.
	7:05pm grtyvr: ↳ -жеи @6:14 And we all know how no Russians are ever forced to lie for the state.
	7:20am ChrisW: Describing the twitter sale as a fleecing of Musk is a novel take!
	11:45am slowbear: Very hard to take this interview seriously when right off the bat you're calling MSNBC a "left-wing organization," which indicates either some confusion on the basics of the left-right political spectrum or a right-wing bias. Funny that you should mention that Taibbi is apparently a Bernie Sanders fan after this, given that during the 2020 election MSNBC had a "body-language expert" analyze Bernie Sanders, and also said that he was going to have public executions in Central Park. This interview also fails to mention any of Musk's clear right-wing libertarian bias and his immediate purging of actual left-wing news outlets and journalists (It's Going Down News, Chad Loder, etc.).
	8:11pm G: 4/20/23 -- I was busy when this aired live, but made a note to get back to it when I had time. -- Ken, thanks for offering this, and for clearly making an effort to be as factual as possible. So many of the commenters seem not to see factual reality, but see only the protective filter that surrounds the information bubble they choose to inhabit, which they rather aggressively insist everybody else should treat as factual.

Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from April 10, 2023

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Conversations with creators and thinkers who are charting the way forward in a tech-saturated society. In our shift to a digital future, we need alternatives to Big Tech. Homepage: techtonic.fm

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Upcoming events:

Mon. Nov 18th, 6pm - 7pm: Astronomer Samantha Lawler returns to Techtonic (More info...)
Thousands of Elon Musk's SpaceX satellites will re-enter Earth's atmosphere in the next few years, adding huge amounts of metals and chemicals to our atmosphere. Astronomer Samantha Lawler returns to Techtonic to explain why satellite "mega-constellations" are causing havoc for astronomers and will soon affect all life on earth.
Mon. Dec 23rd, 6pm - 7pm: Don Fleming guest hosts Techtonic

April 10, 2023: Station Manager Ken fills in and interviews Journalist Matt Taibbi

Listen to this show: MP3 - 128K | Pop-up listen Pop-up player!

Artist	Track	Album	Label	Year	Format	Comments	Images	New * / Special ***	Approx. start time
Matt Taibbi Interview	"Matt Taibbi Interview"								0:00:00 (MP3 \| Pop-up)

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Listener comments!
	6:04pm Hopey Sockmonkey: Thanks for filling in, Ken!
	6:04pm Doug in MP: Matt Taibbi 😬
	🤖 6:04pm Will thee Sound Guy: Hi Staysh and all!!!
	6:05pm wholewheattoast: yeah... let's see how this goes but, uh, huh.
	🤖 6:05pm Bas NL: Hi Ken! All!
	🤖 6:05pm Ken From Hyde Park: Welcome to Kentech! All your data is belong to WFMU!
	6:05pm Doug in MP: Oh no. oh boy
	6:06pm melinda: howdy Ken and others
	6:06pm dale: never twittered. or instant grammed. lots of pornhub though....
	6:06pm Jim the Poet: Popping popcorn
	6:07pm rhett: Fuck Taibbi.
	🤖 6:07pm Handy Haversack: Evening, Ken and the Techyon Drives!
	6:07pm Ike: ↳ wholewheattoast @6:05 Um, yeah.
	6:07pm melinda: I agree Ken. The critics of the Twitter files are avoiding dealing with the substance of the files.
	🤖 6:07pm Will thee Sound Guy: ↳ Ken From Hyde Park @6:05 nice
	6:07pm drew: why is ken freedman associating with a known rapist and woman hater, oh wait is that "slander"
	6:09pm HyperDose: Stir that pot, Ken! 😎
	6:09pm Doug in MP: "ambushed" oh ken. back to bandcamp
	6:10pm melinda: ↳ Doug in MP @6:09 it was an ambush
	6:10pm Ike: That said, it doesn't have to be black and white when it comes to Twitter corporate management. Both current AND former Twitter management can be absolute trash, in different ways.
	🤖 6:10pm herb.nyc: Ooh, lefties get slagged! Right-wingers too, I assume. But do they get complimented at all?
	6:11pm yippie: the Fugs rock opera Star Peace has a cool song called Technology
	🤖 6:11pm Webhamster Henry: Elon whited out the "w" on the Twitter HQ banner so it kind of reads "T_itter". As well as sticking that Dogecoin doggie in instead of the Twitterbird. Whattup wid dat?
	🤖 6:11pm Handy Haversack: Wait, there are people on the Left who like the NYT and MSNBC? Have ... they ever actually read them?
	6:12pm chrisw: Describing the twitter owners as having fleeced Elon Musk is a novel take!
	6:12pm melinda: The pod w/Walter Kirn is really good.
	🤖 6:13pm Will thee Sound Guy: that 60 hz+ harmonics in the right channel is light, but rough
	6:14pm drew: Wait! What? I hate this show and was turning it off when I recognized Matt Taibbi's voice. Deftly played, Mark.
	6:14pm Ike: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:11 You wouldn't think so. But those are considered "liberal" by large portions of the country, among normies too basic to be aware of better sources.
	6:14pm -жеи: ↳ drew @6:07 Drew, the allegations that Taibbi abused women at The Exile office in Moscow, were debunked by the women themselves, who went on record to say that nothing of the sort that was described ever happened.
	6:15pm -жеи: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:11 He's a freaking buffoon is what's up with that
	6:16pm EmP: This is all very odd for this show. Which is the polite way of saying this kind of sucks.
	6:16pm Richy4619: It's really awful what people do when they think they're smarter than everyone.
	6:16pm -жеи: ↳ Will thee Sound Guy @6:13 Yeah I tried to get that buzz out of there but it created a weird flanger effect wgen it was removed.
	6:16pm drew: Hang on . . . that Kermit-y voice is Staysh! Doubly well played!
	🤖 6:17pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Ike @6:14 I have trouble believing that they would then self-identify as Left or hold positions that could be described as Left in any system or discourse not skewed as far to the Right as this one is.
	🤖 6:18pm Will thee Sound Guy: ↳ -жеи @6:16 right on, I believe that
	🤖 6:19pm chresti: Hi Ken and Techtonians!
	6:19pm DannyBoyNYC: Ambushed by Hasan? C'mon. Hasan tore him a new one. Taibbi is reporting on whatever Elon feeds him. His journalistic career is over. Go watch the interview.
	6:20pm -жеи: ↳ EmP @6:16 EmP, what is the actual reporting that you take issue with?
	🤖 6:20pm MarciB: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:11 Excellent point
	6:22pm oof: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:17 (i think he meant neoliberals)
	6:22pm Ciggy: Followed Matt Taibbi since the 2018 financial crisis. Especially the AIG scam on Brooklyn's own Joe Cassano, CMOs & MBS'. Here's today's tweet from Glenn Greewald of a 40 year old clip of Ron Paul criticizing the overreach of the FBI the US Security State (FBI/CIA) manipulating our politics and spying on Americans. twitter.com...
	6:23pm -жеи: ↳ DannyBoyNYC @6:19 So is that why Musk has now cut off Substack? Because Taibbi and Weiss and others were doing TOO good a job of doing Elon's bidding?
	6:25pm -жеи: ↳ DannyBoyNYC @6:19 The nature of the errors that Hasan pointed out (Taibbi wrote "CIS" instead of "CISA") is pretty damn trivial, especially when you consider the legion of real, serious errors that MSNBC has made over the years. Such as falling repeatedly for the Hamilton 68 hoax, which Taibbi uncovered.
	🤖 6:28pm PaulRobeson1923: Hi Hi Hi
	6:28pm pp: Ken J
	6:28pm -жеи: ↳ DannyBoyNYC @6:19 And all the errors that Hasan pointed out (live on national TV, which is why it was an ambush) were corrected by Taibbi immediately and publicly. MSNBC has not issued any corrections of it's own for repeatedly falling for the Hamilton 68 hoax.
	6:31pm pp: I remember pops Taibbi, correspondent for NBC.
	🤖 6:31pm MarciB: Muskrat bought Twitter to destroy it as a legitimate source of information.
	6:32pm dale: a dive into TRUTH social would probably read like a comedy.
	6:34pm -жеи: ↳ pp @6:31 I remember him also - he wrote for the Home News in new Brunswick which was the daily paper I grew up with.
	🤖 6:34pm Handy Haversack: I think what bothers me about the whole discussion (and while I wouldn't speak for Mark, what seems to have the most resonance with what we discuss here frequently) isn't the extent to which Twitter was or was not hand-in-glove with government "intelligence community" for censorship or whether Twitter censorship is now just based on the whim of an egoistic libertarian fuckwad but that we're at all surprised by any of it. Twitter does not exist for us or for any user. It has always and only been based on monetizing engagement through the manipulation of a publishing environment. The point isn't how terrible it was then because of THEM or is now because of OTHER THEM but that it is rotten to its core and cannot be redeemed and the only logical response to is abandon it entirely and let it die alone, as it deserves. Otherwise, we're just continuing to stick our hands in the fire and act shocked when we get burned.
	6:36pm chris in the redwoods: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:34 comment clicky-starred!
	6:38pm CIA, CIS, CISA, whatever: "CIS" for "CISA" is not trivial, it's mistaking a non-governmental nonprofit org for a federal agency, and then claiming that the feds did it.
	6:38pm Franco Twinkie: Stalinists, really? Okay, I'm throwing the Bulgarian crackers I got at Grocery Outlet in the trash.
	6:38pm grtyvr: Ken, how do I retract my S4L. Not a fan of supporting platforming this clown
	6:39pm -жеи: ↳ grtyvr @6:38 Consider it done. You lack of any specific Taibbi criticism is duly noted.
	6:40pm CIA, CIS, CISA, whatever: for reference (not guaranteed unbiased or 100% correct): https://www.techdirt.com/2023/04/07/mehdi-hasan-dismantles-the-entire-foundation-of-the-twitter-files-as-matt-taibbi-stumbles-to-defend-it/
	🤖 6:41pm PaulRobeson1923: For most of America, Russia is like that once in a lifetime trip to NYC- Russia only exists in yer imagination and the average American thinks to himself “i’ll never be able to afford that”
	6:41pm Dean: Damn, sorry I couldn't check in earlier. Handy is pointing out @6:34 the tyranny of the network effect. Honestly, I can barely distinguish Twitter under Dorsey from Twitter under Musk, but then I have no account and I read only one feed. In fact, under Musk, Twitter is proving to be (for me, not a customer) far more open.
	6:43pm Carmichael: Not that I'm a brainiac or anything, but I have never seen the value of Twitter as a platform. Other than a vehicle for one's inane rambling.
	6:43pm Dean: Glancing at Ken's comments above, I believe I am largely if not entirely aligned with his take.
	6:44pm grtyvr: Tiabbi is a sloppy "journalist" who routinely gets basic facts wrong. www.techdirt.com...
	6:44pm Rolando: Better late than never, I’ll catch up what I missed in the archives
	6:44pm melinda: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:34 Twitter might be a rotten and stinky town square but as long as its functioning as such it still matters very much that the government is censoring people there. If Twitter rotted away that wouldn't eliminate the govt-non-profit censorship partnership machine that is responsible for this.
	6:45pm grtyvr: He doesn't understand what he is looking at: www.techdirt.com...
	6:45pm Dean: I think you mean you've never see the utility of Twitter, @Carmichael. I agree. It's pointless to me. Even the one feed I follow--Greenwald's--grows tedious and redundant. Taibbi (note the spelling, @grtyvr) is not a scare-quotes journalist. He is a journalist, more productive and effective than a large number of reporters at MSM media.
	6:46pm McMurphy: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:34 Exactly. And CIA, CIS... I agree, it's far from a trivial mistake. And grtyvr, seriously? Are you listening? Are you hoping to never hear anything that doesn't jibe with your worldview?
	6:46pm dale: ↳ Carmichael @6:43 i'm both not smart enough to want a soap box. and too stupid to need one.
	6:46pm Listener Robert: ↳ -жеи @6:34 Then I guess you go me beat. Matt Taibbi came to my attention only in the 1980s when he wrote for the New York Press. But at least in my head I pronounced his last name the way it turned out he did.
	6:47pm Eli: The Hassan interview was an ambush?? Taibbi was so ill-prepared for it (something MT asked for). It was embarrassing.
	6:47pm -жеи: ↳ grtyvr @6:44 I hope some of you call on the air after the interview is over
	6:47pm Carmichael: ↳ Dean @6:45 "He is a journalist, more productive and effective than a large number of reporters" [STOP]
	6:48pm Listener Robert: ↳ -жеи @6:34 Oh, wait, you're referring to his father?
	6:48pm grtyvr: far from not wanting to not hear anything that does not jibe with my world view, but I do want to hear from someone who is thorough and does not make mistakes in understanding.
	6:48pm McMurphy: ↳ Carmichael @6:43 Clearly you've been reading my feed.
	🤖 6:48pm PaulRobeson1923: ↳ dale @6:46 We are ALL, as Huxley says someplace, Great Abbreviators, meaning that none of us has the wit to know the whole truth, the time to tell it if we believed we did, or an audience so gullible as to accept it. -Neil Postman, Amusing Ourselves to Death: Public Discourse in the Age of Show Business
	6:49pm melinda: Taibbi has said he made mistakes in his old Rolling Stone reporting on the financial crisis but I don't remember left-of-center media sources busting his balls over that.
	6:49pm Son Of Pantz: Now that Matt got his big paycheck from Musk, I hope he goes back to real journalism.
	6:49pm yippie: that's why it's so dumb when these American judges make you sweat to tell the Whole truth
	6:49pm pp: my question on Twitter -- how the funk did Evan get the handle @efd ???
	6:50pm Carmichael: ↳ McMurphy @6:48 So you have a Twitter feed for non-twitter users?
	6:51pm chris in the redwoods: ↳ grtyvr @6:48 someone inhuman, perhaps?
	6:52pm Carmichael: The phones don't have a screen we can all hide behind.
	6:53pm oof: i don't understand how musk's intentions of releasing the files aren't relevant. clearly the data leaked reflects his POV
	🤖 6:53pm PaulRobeson1923: I’d like to discuss Clay’s new “Chicken” sound bite. The softly spoken “chicken” really turns me on
	6:53pm Saltonstall: @pp- believe or not @evanfunkdavies was already taken
	🤖 6:53pm Handy Haversack: ↳ melinda @6:49 MSNBC is far to the right of center. Just want to keep that fact, er, centered.
	6:53pm melinda: ↳ Eli @6:47 You don't have to be a fan of Twitter or Musk to see how huge this is.
	6:53pm Carmichael: Hello, I'd like to buy an argument.
	🤖 6:54pm PaulRobeson1923: A man has to have a place to go in the morning.
	🤖 6:54pm Bas NL: Good point, caller.
	6:54pm melinda: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:53 How so?
	6:55pm Dean: We need a definition of "social media" before the slope gets too slippery or the ad too absurdum.
	🤖 6:55pm Handy Haversack: So if we'd had Twitter back when we had to fight off the dinosaurs, we'd never have survived? Did ... the dinosaurs have Twitter?!
	6:55pm grtyvr: Why is asking for journalists to verify sources and stories to get the facts correct an inhuman expectation?
	6:55pm Ciggy: My "Twitter Files" experience stems from the replies that ive seen change from a liberal point of view to a Trumpist POV. Today's example is an analysis of Tucker Carlson in the NY Times twitter.com...
	6:55pm melinda: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:53 Were they opposed to Taibbi before Trump and Russiagate? My point is that allegiances and biases have shifted.
	6:55pm Dano59: ↳ oof @6:53 maybe Musk's intent was to justify his re-amplifying right wing users. I dunno. It's a weird and worse place now, and I doubt Matt T. would agree, he DID say it used to be a fun place and got worse, almost insufferable, presumably during the Trump admin
	6:55pm Carmichael: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:53 Really? I don't watch it, but my assumption is that Fox News and MSNBC are the two poles that everything else falls between.
	6:56pm drew: Cracker barrels and local bars were longer-format than Twitter, but people shared opinions in free time. I'd be willing to bet that the Amish swap stories and opinions at barn-raisings, which aren't just work.
	6:56pm melinda: ↳ Carmichael @6:55 My assumption too, as a non-watcher
	6:56pm chris in the redwoods: ↳ grtyvr @6:55 asking anyone not to make mistakes is to ask of them not to be human, friend.
	6:57pm Dano59: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:53 not even sure where the center is anymore, but corporate media bias protecting a certain capital/govt. narrative is a thing, even at so-called 'liberal' networks.
	6:57pm Carmichael: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:55 @T-Rex
	6:57pm grtyvr: So where is the retractions and corrections?
	🤖 6:57pm Handy Haversack: Terms of service: wfmu.org...
	6:57pm Marie in Queens: Where do the self-identified leftists on this board get their news?
	6:57pm dale: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:48 i read a lot of huxley in my twenties. even his hollywood novel 'after many a summer the swan dies.' i need to revisit his stuff, i loved it.
	6:57pm Jeff Moore: ↳ Carmichael @6:55 Among mainstream corporate media, maybe. But the US mainstream "left" is... basically moderate right.
	6:58pm melinda: yeah, I bet it happens everywhere. Shitting on Twitter misses the point.
	6:58pm Dean: Email is not, too my mind, social media. It's a pain in the ass, but it's entirely asynchronous. Here's why talking about free speech vis-a-vis Twitter is not crazy: when the state strives to impose its own expressive policies on a private operation like Twitter, then it risks violating the First Amendment.
	🤖 6:58pm PaulRobeson1923: The people outside the United States might as well be dead. U know what i mean?
	6:58pm pp: ↳ Saltonstall @6:53 3 letter handles are rare.
	6:58pm Dano59: ↳ Carmichael @6:53 ... no you don't!
	6:58pm Son Of Pantz: We just want to be free to ride our machines and get loaded at WFMU.
	6:58pm nickelbackfanfromportugal: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:57 Usually AP for straight news, but wider than that for opinion based pieces
	6:58pm melinda: ↳ Dean @6:58 Exactly
	6:59pm Eli: ↳ melinda @6:53 Sorry, I don't think Joe Biden asking that non-consensual nude pics of his troubled son be removed from the platform is a big deal.
	6:59pm Dean: @Son Of Pantz: Heh, well said.
	6:59pm Ciggy: Here I am listening to Ken whilst viewing TYT on YouTube
	🤖 6:59pm Handy Haversack: Thanks, Ken! And MT. Efforts appreciated. And always fun when it all gets stirred up.
	6:59pm steveo: Interesting show Thanks Ken!
	6:59pm sufferwords: Operation Mockingbird- Ben Bradlee - the fix been in forever
	6:59pm dale: wfmu is that (s)crappy little station...
	6:59pm melinda: ↳ Eli @6:59 If it was merely that it wouldn't be a big deal but it was way more than that.
	🤖 6:59pm Bas NL: Thanks Ken and Matt.
	6:59pm Marie in Queens: ↳ nickelbackfanfromportugal @6:58 oh, uh huh, that makes sense to me
	7:00pm listener 126464: Thanks, Ken.
	🤖 7:00pm PaulRobeson1923: In American the gist of our foreign news stories are “where is Malaysian flight 390” or when did the queen last blow her nose?
	7:00pm Hopey Sockmonkey: Thanks, Ken!
	7:00pm melinda: ↳ sufferwords @6:59 yup
	7:00pm McMurphy: Great interview and very interesting and timely show - Thanks Ken!
	7:00pm Ciggy: On to PROG - YES!
	7:00pm Richy4619: I'm glad FMU/Techtonic/Ken are here having these kind of conversations
	7:00pm melinda: thanks Ken!
	🤖 7:00pm Will thee Sound Guy: Thank you Ken!
	7:00pm Dano59: thx Ken!
	7:03pm Matt from OK: Thanks for a great interview. The hard work of radical transparency in the sprit of EFF and FOIA advocacy is too often thankless and polarizing on the rare occasions it does get recognized.
	7:05pm grtyvr: ↳ -жеи @6:14 And we all know how no Russians are ever forced to lie for the state.
	7:20am ChrisW: Describing the twitter sale as a fleecing of Musk is a novel take!
	11:45am slowbear: Very hard to take this interview seriously when right off the bat you're calling MSNBC a "left-wing organization," which indicates either some confusion on the basics of the left-right political spectrum or a right-wing bias. Funny that you should mention that Taibbi is apparently a Bernie Sanders fan after this, given that during the 2020 election MSNBC had a "body-language expert" analyze Bernie Sanders, and also said that he was going to have public executions in Central Park. This interview also fails to mention any of Musk's clear right-wing libertarian bias and his immediate purging of actual left-wing news outlets and journalists (It's Going Down News, Chad Loder, etc.).
	8:11pm G: 4/20/23 -- I was busy when this aired live, but made a note to get back to it when I had time. -- Ken, thanks for offering this, and for clearly making an effort to be as factual as possible. So many of the commenters seem not to see factual reality, but see only the protective filter that surrounds the information bubble they choose to inhabit, which they rather aggressively insist everybody else should treat as factual.

Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from April 10, 2023

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